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May 23 2006
10. While I can limit what I perceive, I can not directly control what I perceive; that is, if I choose to perceived a certain event, while I can limit what I perceive of the event, I can not change the outcome by my perception. This observation leads to a confirmation of the assumption of the existence of the universe.
What do you think?
*Well, although I haven't quite figured it out, it's kinda like this. So far, the only thing I know exists is myself and my perception is access to my own existence. I perceive that the universe exists, but it is relatively uncontrollable. This must mean that it carries on, to an extent, regardless of my existence and has to be equal in some regard with my existence. Therefore, it can not not exist because if it didn't, it wouldn't carry on in a manner against what I would want. In other words, if the universe does not exist, then only I exist, and everything is a product of my existence. But we know this is not true because I have to perceive something in order to fill the "blank slate" of existence, unless I create the universe in a manner unbeknownst to myself. I perceive this universe as something that exists, and it carries on by itself, even while I exist, further proving that it isn't a product of me, again, unless I created the universe (or my plane of existence) in a manner unbeknownst to me. But even then, why would I do something in such a way as to displeasure myself, if I had completely control over my plane of existence? Does that make any sense?
What do you think?
*Well, although I haven't quite figured it out, it's kinda like this. So far, the only thing I know exists is myself and my perception is access to my own existence. I perceive that the universe exists, but it is relatively uncontrollable. This must mean that it carries on, to an extent, regardless of my existence and has to be equal in some regard with my existence. Therefore, it can not not exist because if it didn't, it wouldn't carry on in a manner against what I would want. In other words, if the universe does not exist, then only I exist, and everything is a product of my existence. But we know this is not true because I have to perceive something in order to fill the "blank slate" of existence, unless I create the universe in a manner unbeknownst to myself. I perceive this universe as something that exists, and it carries on by itself, even while I exist, further proving that it isn't a product of me, again, unless I created the universe (or my plane of existence) in a manner unbeknownst to me. But even then, why would I do something in such a way as to displeasure myself, if I had completely control over my plane of existence? Does that make any sense?
adam rodrigues
May 23 2006
The observation that I cannot change the outcome of an event by my perception confirms my initial assumption that the universe exists.
I'm missing the connection between the absence of control and the existence of the universe. I can think of a few directions to take from this... but none concrete enough to be sure I'm following you.....
adam rodrigues
May 23 2006
O.. well I read your last post, so I don't know if I totally take back what you said, if you're saying that:
Due to the plane of existence, the all comprehensive standard known as the "universe", that has its inherent sets of rules and regulations, I am simply an outsider perceiving that which is, just, THERE, around me. I guess, a plane of existence established before my existence to give me a grounds for my perception. ( and with all that I probably need to think on it more, i like it, and need to have a firmer grasp on all the othe details involved...., but anyway... )
And the simplicity comes from the fact that, well, if I am fact someone not perceiving, then... things do get REAL complicated... and I don't really want to go there right now.
So it's simpler to believe I am perceiving, and the universe perpetuates itself by rules, and eventual OUTCOMES, that I am not in control of.
Sorry for being a bit verbose.. but am I following you.. somewhat even?
Daniel Morgan
May 24 2006
Makes sense. I agree that the universe seems to spin on whether or not I want it to, seemingly confirming that it's existence is not contingent on mine. LIke you said, the universe would be different if I were controlling it. So yes, I exist and the universe exists. If I did not exist, the universe would still exist. If the universe did not exist, I suspect I would not exist, since existence depends on perception, on perception depends on the perceptible.
